posts about what the headlines would be like if China legalized beating kids in school
Liberal: The headlines wouldnāt be much diff g. Literally so many people above the age of 50 support that shit.
Me: Nah. I feel like western med would be all over that beating the drum about China beating their kids and it would be heavily exaggerated lol like the whole social credit thing.
Liberal: No. Legit no.
Me: How so? So much over there gets misrepresented.
Liberal: I think Chinaās bad, G.
Me: Why? I know itās not perfect, but it has my support.
Liberal: Bro they genocide the Muslims. Police state is it not? The way they enforce stuff. Mainstream media also has a problem with it so it almost certainly is bad in some regard. Plus destiny agrees and some politicians I like.
Me: Uyghur genocide is straight up western fabrication imo, like 30 Muslim envoys just went there and came back defending it. Iāll find the source. Alot of that was propagated by Adrian Zenz who works for the US government and the victims of communism foundation which is a joke lmao. Typical 100 billion dead stuff. As for police state Iām not sure what you consider that to be but I donāt see china gunning down minorities in the street or with 22% of the worldās prison population despite being 4% of the worldās population like the USA. What do you mean the way they enforce stuff? And mainstream media is us government and billionaire funded so it shouldnāt surprise anyone that the narrative is āchina badā and diametrically opposed to socialism. I donāt really like or watch too much destiny, but what politicians?
Liberal: I highly doubt the slaughter is fabricated. I can look into it later to prove you wrong on that. But I doubt china properly reports their imprisoned and data and they enforce things through breaches of privacy.
Me: I really donāt think itās legit. China is poised to take us over economically and is socialist. This is plenty of reason to propagate a genocide when the world order is capitalism. link the site where the state department admits not having enough evidence to declare genocide. Furthermore, most proof for this is usually 144p satellite images of prisons or something ridiculous like that. The falling birthrate argument is bullshit because the Uyghurs have just recently been placed under the same birthrate requirements as the Han so of course they will fall. What makes china less credible than the US? Do you have the same doubts for our bureau? What kinds of breaches of privacy are you speaking of? And like the United States hasnāt been spying on the entire population the entire time?
Lib: You have to understand if we declared genocide all hell would break loose. So first off you understand there is motive for the US to cover it up and not give a fuck? Especially since yk, we donāt necessarily care of Muslims that much? I feel like that would be the first thing that should come to your headā¦ the US donāt care about Muslimsā¦ but ig cause itās china you are dissonance?
Me: Right, the motive is not Muslim lives, I think itās anti-china rhetoric. and dissonance how so
Lib: Wym? uses my name look at your first message. Thats literally the us defending China gang. Come on you aināt dumb. China is less credible because they donāt have the same checks and balances as we do and their departments are corrupt. Thatās why we can say 911 actually happened and why if that Shii happened in China we would have no clue. If you really gaf about both sides you would kno why China cannot be trusted bro
Me: Departments arenāt corrupt here?!? You think our checks and balances genuinely work for the people here? And I donāt mean this in a condescending or rude way but do you know how china works? Like their system of participation?
Lib: there is a difference. Large scale deception is impossible in the US. Departments are separated in the US, in China they are not. Yes they do work for us here. I know not of one country that operates like the US.
Me: How is large scale deception impossible here bro? And youāre right they have far greater participation in many other countries lol including šØš³
Lib (this is where it gets weird): Because Large scale deception implies cooperation between departments. We have real humans in the US with more means and less threat to their lives for leaking info. Prosecutions have to go through judges where everything needs to be declassified. China doesnāt work this way.
Me: You donāt think that those departments have the same class interests? And do you genuinely believe things are always declassified? Also what are you implying with āreal humans in us with more means and less threat to their lives for leaking infoā lol the cia has killed journalists time and time again and or locked them up.
Lib: There could be some deceptions/ things done by individual departments sure but for example, a genocide could never happen in secret. Bro, not everything has to do with class. Other values exist in this world. Plus you forget there are hundreds of thousands of people in these organizations. Things would get leaked. However, china doesnāt grant its citizens the same things to prevent leaks such as heavy regulation of the internet. uses my name, you sound very dumb when you say ādo you genuinely believe all things get declassifiedā. With prosecutions? Literally yes. I donāt think you understand all court cases are public info G. Things have to be declassified in proesections Because it runs through the state judges. Look this up. Also, keyword CIA. A singular department. Meaning they were able to leak things. Dog youāve been legit brainwashed if u think Uighur is faked. Like deadass thatās some conspiracy stuff to claim that shit fake
Me: I am not arguing that it couldnāt be leaked here or that everything is covered up. Iām saying some things surely are. But sure, letās give our government the benefit of the doubt and say that these individual agencies (e.g CIA) are solely responsible for the destruction theyāve caused and no other government force had a play in it. These people were never prosecuted for MKULTRA, for the hundreds of thousands of people killed, millions of lives ruined in the global south, etc. Many things have been leaked like you said, but I think itās incredibly naive to believe that our government is entirely transparent (Here I made an assumption about what they were saying). Where are you making these assumptions about China from? As for the internet, they are subject to cyber attacks and heavy western influence. Of course they want a secure internet. Furthermore, you can literally get a VPN or some other shit and get around it, plenty of chinese do. Nobody is coming after you for that. Yes, everything when prosecuted is declassified, Iām talking about the things that arenāt prosecuted and havenāt been leaked. Yes, we have protections in theory. This does not stop the persecution and suspicious unaliving of journalists and radical figures.
Lib: What assumptions do you refer to? Officials get away with incredibly terrible programs like MKULTRA which mind you, are INDIVIDUAL DEPARTMENTS, they have nothing to do with other departments. Deadass. Believe what you want, but that is legit how our government functions. Wdym our government is entirely transparent? I never said that. At all. my name. You are not defending there regulations on the internet gang. Deadass youāve been brainwashed
Me: I apologize for putting words in your mouth. It seemed that was what you were saying to me
Lib: Iām saying china works together department wise to prosecute without the checks and balance given in our systems. You can be honest if you dk what you talking about. Iād also bet a lot of the journalists and figures you talk about that were unalived are genuinly just conspiracies youāve only looked at from one side. I promise probably half of the mfs you think are subject to death by CIA is legit just a conspiracy wit little evidence. Also the VPN suggestion is laughable. Look that one up bud.
Me: having a vpn is banned, yes. That doesnāt mean there arenāt ways to get around it if you want to see the western internet so badly?
Lib:I love how In your mind the INTERNET is just WESTERN MEDIA PROPORGANDA š
Me: Itās not lol? Iām saying this obsession with being able to say whatever you want with no consquences and all of the shit we have to sift through here is what, in my mind, would be penetrating into Chinese internet
Lib: Itās either u have a foundamental lack of understanding how they regulate the internet, or genuinly ur brain is wired to think internet is western mediaā¦ its also funny you say that. Considering you didnāt think about that when u supported the idea uigher Muslim genocide Is fake. Literal Concentration camps exist there Sure they arenāt extermination camps if thatās what you feel Iām implying but thag shit is REAL. And youāre a moron if you think itās fake. Anyways point is Chinese are bred to be nationalist but also you believe the shit that comes out of their mouth even tho they have every reason to look out for thenselves only.
Me: I donāt appreciate the moron comment. Anyways. Yeah, every reason to look out for themselves only because theyāre fucking targeted endlessly by the rest of the world for upholding a different social order lolā¦ also Americans are bred to be nationalist hard-core too I donāt see the point. I think weāre not going to get anywhere. Support to china from me.
Lib: I think the world dislikes them for more then just upholding a āsocial orderā
I then stop responding.
Am I stupid? Is the Liberal being overly condescending or am I just sensitive? Iād like to know your feedback. Thanks for reading if you did.
Everything they said is complete projection. Full stop. The idea that the US state isnāt corrupt because there exists separate departments is utterly ridiculous. The US state feeds off corruption, itās the primary motivator of policy, corruption is literally completely legal in the US. Also, does this person think there arenāt separate departments of state in china? Even a wiki page will tell you otherwise.
The US is a police state. Much more so than china. You donāt hold a quarter of the worlds prison population despite being a tiny percent of the global population without being one. US police are amongst the heaviest armed in the world, the NYPD alone is better equiped in military gear than most militaries in the world. Police operate with near full impunity in this country because of corrupt local governments and police unions. Police brutality resulting in the death on innocents is almost a weekly occurance. I donāt ever want to here libs say china is a police state when they live in and vouch for the biggest police state on the planet. Infuriating argument.
Add to this, the complete dismissal of any wrongdoing by the US towards political dissent as āconspiracy nonsenseā is incredibly rich considering they believe there is currently happening a mass genocide of Uighurs of which the only āevidenceā we have of happening is blurry satellite images and massive leaps in assumptions made from china putting more security in the region. Even on wikipedia, any western media really, they admit the US has participated in many cases of jailing, suppressing and murdering political dissenters. Itās not something thatās under wraps that we need to theorize on, itās in the open and they openly admit to it. As socialists we can admit that socialist states have done bad things to dissenters that werenāt necessary at all, but when you point out that the US has done the same libs immediately jump into denial and call you crazy, itās infuriating.
The internet thing is silly. Itās very obvious that sites like reddit, Facebook, Twitter, etc are completely dominated by Americans and American rhetoric. Ridiculous to claim that china not allowing those sites is somehow authoritarian, especially when the US doesnāt allow certain Chinese sites and has literally banned Chinese tech companies from selling or operating in the country.
Overall itās just impossible to argue with these types. They operate on the false premises that everything china says or anything coming out of china must be wrong and bad, no exceptions, and anything coming out of western press are the only resources you should care about. Itās china bad syndrome. The mere idea of china sparks a fear inside them that initiates a sort of fight or flight response where they either deny or deflect any information contrary to the narrative they believe in.
Not too long ago I was in an argument with some lib on Matrix (who btw. claimed to be a ML despite the fact that theyāve never read a single line of Marx or Lenin) and they were calling me brainwashed because I support AES countries. I asked them āIf I canāt trust anything China says, then what CAN I trust?ā and they replied āYou need to look for defectors and listen what they have to say.ā. When I told them that all the US Media is controlled by the state which acts in the interest of the ruling class, they started calling me crazy. Because according to them the U.S. Media doesnāt spread that much propaganda and mostly report on āindependentā truths.
Diagnosis? China bad syndrome.
The ālisten to defectorsā is always a great bit. Literally just admitting āonly listen to people that agree with my worldviewā. Because of course, every person that has lived or lives in a socialist country and disagrees with libs are just brainwashed. Every single one of them. I donāt understand how someone can honestly believe that.
Exactly. Absolutely asinine. I didnāt even want to get into that because itād be a whirlwind of crap. I know this because I once talked about lobbying (corruption) and he said that he doesnāt believe lobbying has that great of an impact on how politicians vote. Iām entirely serious.
He apparently believes the entirety of the Chinese government is the NPC who controls everything everywhere all the timeā¦
I tried to hint back at the US being far more of a police state than China and he didnāt respond to it, I believe itās somewhere in the discussion. I think I even used that statistic about 22% of the worldās prison population. Regardless, this guy genuinely believes our systems work well and is balls deep in American exceptionalism. Pathetic.
I totally agree with you on the internet thing. I think you put it alot better than I did. For real, werenāt they just trying to ban tiktok because āchina badā like a year ago?
It really is. False premises, fast talking, insults. They then call it a W.