The co-founder of failed cryptocurrency exchange FTX pleaded not guilty to a seven count indictment charging him with wire fraud, securities fraud and money laundering.

An attorney for FTX co-founder Sam Bankman-Fried said in federal court Tuesday his client has to subsist on bread, water and peanut butter because the jail he’s in isn’t accommodating his vegan diet.

  • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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    1 year ago

    locking him up won’t get anyone their money back. i don’t know what would be the right thing to do but i don’t see how keepin him in a cage helps anyone.

    • FuglyDuck@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      It’s called “justice” and in an ideal society it comes for everyone.

      He commited billions of dollars worth of fraud. This was an intentional act. It might not “do any good”- but let me ask you, in a nation of laws, would allowing one that blatant to escape justice do any good? And what about the harm caused by signaling that Stanford-lawyer-parents means you’re immune to prosecution?

      Lock him up. Give him his crappy budget-vegan-diet and let him serve as an example. (Even if only that example is to not steal from rich assholes.)

      • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        1 year ago

        It’s called “justice” and in an ideal society it comes for everyone.

        i don’t think justice is a vengeful spectre. i think it’s everyone feeling that wrongs have been righted, and i don’t see how locking him in a cage lets him right his wrongs.

        • FuglyDuck@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          hard to imagine how SBF is going to return 8 billion he hasn’t got.

          hard to imagine how Floyd is going to get the same opportunity when he got choked out for 20 bucks. your sense of justice is tiered. Rich white guy? let him right wrongs! who cares that he’s ruined lives beyond recovery.

          • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            1 year ago

            your sense of justice is tiered.

            ? when did you ask me about george floyd? where did you see me mention him? you don’t fucking know me.

          • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            1 year ago

            i don’t really believe punishment is necessary, but surely there is something we could do to get him to help like… fix the problems he created for others.

            • KoboldCoterie@pawb.social
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              1 year ago

              I mean, I agree with the core of what you’re saying, but there’s a difference between believing in rehabilitation over punishment for someone who robbed a convenience store because they needed money to feed their baby, and someone who exhibited this degree of sociopathic behavior.

              What would you propose we do to fix the problems he created? He could spend a lifetime paying it back bit by bit and still not be finished when he dies.

                • KoboldCoterie@pawb.social
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                  1 year ago

                  It ensures he can’t harm anyone else, for one. It provides some measure of closure and peace of mind to the victims, for another. It’s not like it’s just financial crimes, it’s witness tampering and threats that he’s in there for. How else can the witnesses feel safe? If I were they, I certainly wouldn’t feel safe if he was out on the street.

                  • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                    1 year ago

                    It ensures he can’t harm anyone else, for one

                    no, it doesn’t: there are other people in prisons.

                  • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                    1 year ago

                    How else can the witnesses feel safe? If I were they, I certainly wouldn’t feel safe if he was out on the street.

                    i don’t see how anyone is safer with him locked in a cage.

            • Flying Squid@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              He stole millions of dollars and tried to ruin people’s reputations to save his ass in court and you think no punishment is necessary?

              So he should be free to just do it all again?

              • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                1 year ago

                I just don’t believe in punishment. I think that we could find another solution that actually helps people. we might even help him.

                • Flying Squid@lemmy.world
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                  1 year ago

                  What specifically would stop him from ruining more lives? The man put his ex-girlfriends diary online to stop her from testifying. He’s fucking evil.

                  • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                    1 year ago

                    i didn’t know all the details and it certainly sounds like he’s done some shitty things, but putting him in prison doesn’t stop him from ruining more lives.

    • kaosof@sh.itjust.works
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      1 year ago

      The main thing is to dissuade people from doing what he did, right?

      Fuck around and find out and all that.

      If it has any actual use for anyone (e.g. separating dangerous people from society, taking stolen property/money back, preventing them from committing more crimes etc), that’s entirely unintentional.

      • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        1 year ago

        If it has any actual use for anyone (e.g. separating dangerous people from society, taking stolen property/money back, preventing them from committing more crimes etc), that’s entirely unintentional.

        shouldn’t those sorts of things be the actual goal of any “justice system”?

      • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        1 year ago

        The main thing is to dissuade people from doing what he did, right?

        but that doesn’t work.

        • FlowVoid@midwest.social
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          1 year ago

          Of course it works. If you threaten someone with jail when they do X, then they are less likely to do X.

          To take one example, several states have recently threatened doctors with jail if they perform abortions. As a result, obstetricians are now fleeing those states to avoid being prosecuted for performing their normal medical duties. If jail had no deterrent effect, then obstetricians would stay put and keep doing what they’ve always been doing, including performing safe abortions.

          To take another example, several state have recently decriminalized marijuana, thus reduces the risk of jail for sale and possession. As a result, marijuana is more commonly consumed in public and far more commonly sold in public. If jail had no deterrent effect, there would be no change in the number of businesses selling marijuana.

            • FlowVoid@midwest.social
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              1 year ago

              Something doesn’t have to be 100% effective to work.

              Quitting smoking works to prevent cancer. That doesn’t mean it is 100% effective in preventing cancer.

              • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                1 year ago

                so you think the solution to stop someone from doing something you don’t like is to put someone else in a cage. i just can’t do that. that’s wrong.

                • FlowVoid@midwest.social
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                  1 year ago

                  I can’t stop anyone from doing something I don’t like.

                  But historically, there have been plenty of solutions to stop someone from doing something society doesn’t like. For example, execution. Torture. Punishing their relatives. Exile. Prison. And asking them nicely to please stop.

                  Of those, I think prison is the best option. Putting someone in a cage may seem wrong, but letting them freely murder and rape innocent people is more wrong.

                  • commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                    1 year ago

                    i prefer asking them nicely to please stop. i also think exile is fine, but we should try shunning first.

    • jmp242@sopuli.xyz
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      1 year ago

      It’s interesting to me to meet someone wholly anti jail. I think our “justice system” is anything but, and at least that’s partially because we have a completely muddled idea about what we’re even trying to accomplish - mostly because of all these different opinions.

      It seems pretty clear that our jails are “technically” just this side of cruel and unusual punishment as defined by our courts. But it’s all about punishment. Of course this assumes that retribution is a useful goal, and as you point out - it probably isn’t.

      It’s also dubious that there’s any deterrence effect from jail sentences. Lots of people believe there is, but the studies I’ve seen don’t bear that out.

      It’s also pretty clear that jail is expensive and just as likely to make criminals worse rather than better, so from a societal perspective, there’s a really good reason to re-think our justice system.

      However, given our current system is about punishment and making victims and society at large feel better because “those who fucked around found out” - I would still prefer to see this guy get his to remind people we do in fact have laws and might enforce them.